where?
Correspondent:: elvis_bond@hotmail.com
Date: 2 Feb 2005 07:47:22 -0800

--------
So, the good old USA is going to eradicate the Afghan opium crops.

Presently, they supply 75% of the world's supply.

It makes no sense unless the good old USA (meaning Bush and friends)
has an alternative lined up. South America?
That would be my guess.

In that case, it's not about eradication but shifting the center of
allowed cultivation.

Has anyone watched "Traffik", the original British production, not the
cheezy good old USA ripoff that left out all of the good stuff and
turned it into a piece of trash (like Howard Hughes's "favorite" movie,
The Poppy is also a Flower)

What about Pakistan? Wouldn't they love to take over production?
Eliminate those wild Afghans from the market and jack up the price.

Don't forget Tasmania..site of Australia's legal crop. What the heck is
going on. It costs nothing to grow opium poppies.
Get out of our lives good old USA.



Correspondent:: elvis_bond@hotmail.com
Date: 2 Feb 2005 08:04:45 -0800

--------
I looked around the internet. The price of retail and wholesale heroin
has gone
DOWN by 50% in the last ten years.

Apparently, that is pinching someone's trust fund, so the trust fund
babies who run the good old USA are eliminating some of the supply to
get the prices back up.



Correspondent:: elvis_bond@hotmail.com
Date: 2 Feb 2005 08:46:56 -0800

--------
http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/heroin/historic.htm

1.) Dominant Trend: Although repression disrupted the global heroin
trade for several years, over the longer term Nixon's drug war
stimulated both opium production and heroin consumption. Ignoring these
lessons, the Reagan and Bush administrations later pursued parallel
policies in Latin America with dismal results. In essence, all three
drug wars extended a local law enforcement model into the international
arena in a way that failed to reduce either drug production or exports.
Stimulated in part by three US drug wars, Asian opium production
increased from 1,000 tons in 1970 to 4,000 tons in 1989.


2.) Implication: When law enforcement is applied to such an elaborate
commerce, drug syndicates usually react in ways not foreseen by
enforcement agencies. Treating this global commodity trade as if it
were a localized vice, U.S. drug agencies often apply repression
without any awareness of the intricate dynamics of these worldwide
marketing systems. For both legal and illicit commodities, a crop
failure in one production zone--whether from war, drought, or
disease--creates a shortage of supply and raises the price for
producers elsewhere, stimulating increased production in the next crop
cycle.



Correspondent:: Zapanaz
Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2005 09:27:59 -0800

--------
On 2 Feb 2005 08:46:56 -0800, elvis_bond@hotmail.com wrote:

>http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/heroin/historic.htm
>
>1.) Dominant Trend: Although repression disrupted the global heroin
>trade for several years, over the longer term Nixon's drug war
>stimulated both opium production and heroin consumption. Ignoring these
>lessons, the Reagan and Bush administrations later pursued parallel
>policies in Latin America with dismal results. In essence, all three
>drug wars extended a local law enforcement model into the international
>arena in a way that failed to reduce either drug production or exports.
>Stimulated in part by three US drug wars, Asian opium production
>increased from 1,000 tons in 1970 to 4,000 tons in 1989.
>
>
>2.) Implication: When law enforcement is applied to such an elaborate
>commerce, drug syndicates usually react in ways not foreseen by
>enforcement agencies. Treating this global commodity trade as if it
>were a localized vice, U.S. drug agencies often apply repression
>without any awareness of the intricate dynamics of these worldwide
>marketing systems. For both legal and illicit commodities, a crop
>failure in one production zone--whether from war, drought, or
>disease--creates a shortage of supply and raises the price for
>producers elsewhere, stimulating increased production in the next crop
>cycle.

It doesn't matter really.

Drug wars are a moral issue, a form of crusade. Drug users are to
right-wing politicians what jews were to the Nazis, an
easily-demonizable minority that they can go after and everybody will
rally behind them. It's like the countless mid-budget cop movies and
TV shows that have been made where the Bad Guys are some vaguely
defined kind of Drug Pushers. It is supposed to make it crystal clear
who the Good Guys are. Whether the crusade actually -works- is
largely irrelevant. Really, it's even better if the crusade is
completely futile and just ends up producing more Bad Guys to go
crusading against. Just as long as plenty of lives get ruined and
there is plenty of hot-action footage for the evening news.

One problem with the modern world is that everybody is supposed to
pretend that they don't believe in demons anymore. Religious
paraphernalia like demons and spirits and kings with magical powers
and so on are obviously part of the wiring of the human mind, very
similar ideas rose up in independant cultures for thousands of years,
so it seems likely that there is something physical in how we think
that tends towards these beliefs.

So now we get into the modern world, just in the last century or
couple of centuries, and now everybody is supposed to not believe in
them any more. But it's still part of the wiring, part of the thought
process, so people still produce new forms of demons, they just learn
not to call them demons (or they become fundamentalist Christians
where it's OK to believe in things that are absurd). Subconsciously
or semi-consciously people still have a -feel- that there are these
shadowy forces of evil lurking out there; and that's where the
brain's hard-wiring shows up, in how things -feel-.

So if a politiician can produce some tangible kind of cardboard cutout
demon for people to spit at, there will be some substantial percent of
them that say "ah HA! See, I -told- you there were demons out there,
Mildred! But you wouldn't listen!"

If you're left-wingy it can be people who wear fur and eat meat. If
you're right-wingy it can be people who smoke drugs or homos or fiends
who use logic.

Just somebody who can be pointed at and say "people like THAT are
what's wrong with the world, I tell you what!" People like THAT are
the DEMONS of the modern world.



--
Zapanaz
International Satanic Conspiracy
Customer Support Specialist
http://joecosby.com/
Synthesizers don't make trouble; people humping them like crazed WEASELS
make the trouble.

HellPope Huey,



Correspondent:: Zapanaz
Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2005 09:31:38 -0800

--------
On Wed, 02 Feb 2005 09:27:59 -0800, Zapanaz
wrote:

>Just somebody who can be pointed at and say "people like THAT are
>what's wrong with the world, I tell you what!" People like THAT are
>the DEMONS of the modern world.

I think it's our job, in the Church of the Subgenius, to be the first
minority to be the demons WILLINGLY. I won't be satisfied until the
US government declares war on the Church of the Subgenius.

this may not be a popular idea.

--
Zapanaz
International Satanic Conspiracy
Customer Support Specialist
http://joecosby.com/
When I smile, you'll know it. You'll hear a sound like a beer bottle
smashing.

- nenslo



Correspondent:: "Rev. Ivan Stang"
Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2005 14:59:16 -0500

--------
In article <3i3201h73t4t4mm25hhcs3lpa9omhtbimb@4ax.com>, Zapanaz wrote:


>
> I think it's our job, in the Church of the Subgenius, to be the first
> minority to be the demons WILLINGLY. I won't be satisfied until the
> US government declares war on the Church of the Subgenius.
>
> this may not be a popular idea.

Hell, we declared war on the U.S. gov't, God, and pretty much everybody
else, many years ago, and the cowards hide their heads in the sand and
pretend we don't even exist.

--
The SubGenius Foundation, Inc.
(4th Stangian Orthodox MegaFisTemple Lodge of the Wrath of Dobbs Yeti,
Resurrected, Rev. Ivan Stang, prop.)
P.O. Box 181417, Cleveland, OH 44118 (fax 216-320-9528)
Dobbs-Approved Authorized Commercial Outreach of The Church of the SubGenius
SubSITE: http://www.subgenius.com PRABOB


Correspondent:: HellPope Huey
Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2005 23:45:43 GMT

--------
In article <3i3201h73t4t4mm25hhcs3lpa9omhtbimb@4ax.com>,
Zapanaz wrote:

> I think it's our job, in the Church of the Subgenius, to be the first
> minority to be the demons WILLINGLY. I won't be satisfied until the
> US government declares war on the Church of the Subgenius.
> this may not be a popular idea.

That depends on who you ask. Besides, the whole government going after
us as a group would be like sending an 8-year-old girl into the ring to
confront 2 Predators and a starving pit bull. Please don't hurt, me
mister! (POW! SQUISH!! RIIIP!! aieeeee* drip drip drip...)

--

HellPope Huey
Head waiter at Madame La CaCa's House of Monkey

"To be too conscious is an illness,
a real throughgoing illness."
- Fyodor Dostoevski

"We coulda been anything that we wanted to be,
with all the talent we had;
with a little training, we mastered complaining;
manners seemed unnecessary,
we're so rude its almost scary!
We coulda been anything that we wanted to be
and don't it make your heart glad?
With a little practice, we made every blacklist!
We're the very best at being bad!"
- "Bugsy Malone"


Correspondent:: "splendid_blond_beast"
Date: 2 Feb 2005 09:37:58 -0800

--------
Grow your own!
http://www.poppies.org
I believe cultivation is legal in most states and federally in the US,
harvesting the latex might be a different issue.......



Correspondent:: "splendid_blond_beast"
Date: 2 Feb 2005 08:59:48 -0800

--------

elvis_b...@hotmail.com wrote:
> So, the good old USA is going to eradicate the Afghan opium crops.
>
> Presently, they supply 75% of the world's supply.
>
> It makes no sense unless the good old USA (meaning Bush and friends)
> has an alternative lined up. South America?
> That would be my guess.

Turkey produces quite a bit of the "illicit" opium crop in the world
and could probably increase production multifold if needed. Given their
proximity to iRaq & Europa and relatively friendly relationship w/ the
US (@ least since those pesky soviets have been out of the picture) IF
the [usually disinformational] news stories on drugs are to any degree
correct, I would bet on Turkey.

In re: the Tasmanian poppy crop, the taswegian opium farmers there have
developed a strain of papverus somniferum that is high in the alkaloid
Thebaine while being very low in the alkaloid Morphine, the two
narcotic alkaloids of the opium poppy. This since most of the crop is
reduced to poppy straw concentrate and converted to opioids such as
hydro/oxycodone & codeine by your friendly multinational Johnson &
Johnson corporation rat thar on Tazzie! So it isn't a likely candidate.

You didn't mention the fabled Hartz Mountains of Deutschland, home of
some of the best somniferum ever cultivated, by your friendly,
multinational Bayer Corporation, holder of the patent for the formula
for heroin BTW.

Check out this site for some pretty cool opium related stuff:
http://www.opioids.com

Peace



Correspondent:: "nu-monet v7.0"
Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2005 10:14:46 -0700

--------
elvis_bond@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> So, the good old USA is going to eradicate
> the Afghan opium crops.
>

Even back when Nixon was in office, the intelligence
estimate was that there was going to be a War on
Terror (Wot). Specifically a *narcotics* WoT, not
the current one.

Based on the US experience with prohibition, and the
assumption that market forces can overwhelm any and
all methods to stop them, the conclusion was reached
that drugs would result in one of two things:

1) What would amount to civil wars in every country
on the planet, with every tyrant and revolutionary
using drugs to finance his operation (this has become
the scenario in parts of South America, BTW). And
it would be obscenely expensive to stop it, and maybe
not even possible. Or,

2) The US could take over the drug markets, with the
idea that it would let a market supply through, but
divert the money and guns away from troublemakers.
This has to be done using coercion, because the vital
production side cannot be easily controlled, leaving
only distribution and the finance side of the house
open to manipulation by the US.

This second option was decided on, and every US
President since has had to come to terms with it.

It should be noted that the USs most overt anti-drug
efforts takes place in areas where it is *also* likely
that somebody is hoping to use the proceeds to
destabilize. But there are many places where drugs
are produced where this is *not* the case, and there,
the US generally just ignores it.

Is there an eventual end or exit to this policy?, is
the $64 question. A very good question, and one I'm
sure a lot of people have put a lot of thought into.


--
I don't know what you're talking about.
I've never met you before in my life.
That story sounds like utter bullshit.
I wasn't there and it wasn't me.
I am *not* in denial. Shut up.
--nu-monet


Correspondent:: nenslo
Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2005 22:31:58 -0800

--------
elvis_bond@hotmail.com wrote:
> (like Howard Hughes's "favorite" movie,
> The Poppy is also a Flower)

I keep telling you people Hughes' favorite movie was Ice Station Zebra.


Correspondent:: "splendid_blond_beast"
Date: 2 Feb 2005 23:52:08 -0800

--------

nenslo wrote:

> I keep telling you people Hughes' favorite movie was Ice Station
Zebra.

ONLY when he had @ least a half gallon of pistachio ice cream.



Correspondent:: "Doktor Dark"
Date: 3 Feb 2005 00:56:59 -0800

--------
and some good herion! and a Mormon to give it to him!